Monday Morning Update 11/13/06

To PTSD's comment: Epic won't acquire any other company (that's one of Judy's "principles"). They find other people's good ideas and then build them for themselves. Less cost, more control.

To everyone else: Alleging that Epic is an inferior product is barking up the wrong tree (and makes me a tad suspicious that you're a Cerner employee). The reason to hate Epic is their lousy treatment of their people and their violations of WI labor law. From their mandatory 45-hour work week to their age-ist and racist hiring practices (Epic does not generally hire anyone over the age of 25 and it rarely hires African Americans or Hispanics) to their union busting, Epic is a blemish in the cradle of the Progressive Movement and the US union movement. It amazes me that the land of Fightin' LaFolette allows them to do what they do, but I suppose that Verona doesn't want them to pull up stakes when the tax-breaks Epic got to build out there expire. Face it, Epic makes WalMart look like an employee-friendly company! And regardless of your politics, exploiting your workforce will eventually come back and bite you.

I concur with much of the comments from OutsideIn and Raleigh1776 about the limited ability of the middle managers within Misys to freely voice opinions that were unfavorable in the eyes of Tom Skelton and other senior executives. There was rough going for those who found fault with the wavering PPO initiative, the mind-numbing overuse of the“geese” video, the lingering Lean Six Sigma projects (DNA, end-to-end sales), project Viking or a number of other items. The comments of OutsideIn and Raleigh1776 are spot on and those still remaining within Misys would be wise to keep that in mind! In his posting, Scott Sanner noted to Tom Skelton was to busy to be concerned with "sniffers". I agree…Skelton himself didn’t put the sniffers onto the network. Still, when the need for information about a failing partnership arose, that information on what was communicated, who was involved and how this information got out of Misys was “miraculously found”. Isn’t that brilliant to imagine even though those directly involved had deleted their files or no longer had copies of the information? Hmmmm? Dirty work such as uncovering these types of communications, chat, etc. is often carried out by underlings. That gives distance and deniability to senior managers.

I wonder if Kaiser reviews the *employment practices* of their vendors before choosing them? If we ask companies to look at whether they are condoning a sweatshop or upholding a dictatorship in some other country, isn't it just a matter of business ethics to look at how potential U.S. partners treat their employees as well? Also, this looks to me like Epic could be a lynchpin in examining the "all work with computers is exempt" policy of the DOL.

Re:Disgruntled Ex-Epic Employee. Reading your comments about Epic and looking at your handle makes me wonder if your comments are truly objective. 45 hrs a week isn't that uncommon for most professionals these days. I'm sure others who read this blog (docs, consultants etc) work long weeks themselves. Are you sure it was mandatory? Or maybe you are just taking the "working 9-5" expectation too literally? As far as the labor practices etc comments from you and also by Gadfly, just read the link that Mr.Histalk posted to the story about Epic's new campus. Sounds like a pretty sweet place to work to me! Regardless I hope that after you left Epic you found a job that met your work hours expectations and are happy with it.

I would have to agree with the comment above about it not be uncommon for people in this industry to work more than 40 hours a week. The thing about software is that there is no light at the end of the tunnel; there will always be something more to do and if you are someone who can't prioritize, say no, or delegate, then you'll find yourself in your office very late at night indeed.

Epic's also not in the habit of sending out anything resembling a "tick tock" email. Let's be fair here before you start throwing about the computer exception to the labor laws.

Also, when a fair percentage of your employees are just out of college or grad school and are used to working 12 or 13 hour days every day of the week, a 45-hour M-F work week seems like a dream in comparison. I know I've worked places where they require you to "volunteer" for Saturdays and have extra time on busy days like Mondays - turning your 40 hour week into a mandatory 50 hour week. Epic sounds pretty darn nice.

From what I've heard from friends who work there and as it's been mentioned in HIStalk before, Epic hires young because it's easier to train new habits than untrain old habits. There are plenty of new hires over the age of 30. As for "racist" hiring practices, I wonder how closely the various hiring rates for different racial backgrounds corresponds to the applicant rate?

I worked at Kaiser IT on several projects over a twelve year period. The problem is not just Epic. It is the overall tribal culture at both the IT and Call Center departments. Mediocrity is rewarded, talent is fired, and God forbid if you have a disability or are the wrong religion.

I speak from experience. After four successful long-term projects, I was contracted to work on a large implementation project at an executive level. While there, I began undergoing a problem with my eyesight. This, in no way, impacted on the quality of my work, though it was a difficult personal experience.

It became a professional problem when one of the other executives took to approaching me rom behind at meetings, clamping her hands on my shoulders which caused me to jump, as I did not have the peripheral vision to see her approach -- something I had informed her of. She would then complain loudly throughout the meeting that I had a tendancy to overreact.

When I brought this to my superior (who was at a high executive level), he told me she had been complaining for several weeks that my personality was not suited for Kaiser, calling me too 'excitable' (not a description anyone who knows me would apply). When I pointed out the quality of my work and that I got along with everyone else, the executive confided that the woman was a personal friend of the head of the call center and that the head of an IT area I was in charge of converting had made comments about my religion and did not want me there, either.

As I was not an employee and could tell this executive would not risk his job for me, I had no recourse but to move on.

I have not worked since.

To the person who commented on Epic's campus, that's exactly the impression it wants to create. The reality is, it's much more like a normal company than it cares to admit. Which doesn't make it bad, it's just that a lot of people resent the propaganda once they realize Epic isn't really what it says it is in terms of the work environment. The other factor is the much-discussed cult-like mentality at Epic. It's not just the hours, which are sometimes long but not always. What gets to people is the implicit expectation that you buy into the job with mind body and soul. And related to what another person wrote, it's easier to get new grads to do that, and if not, they're easily replaceable.

To all the CEOs and executives of companies out there today, how many of you would like your employees to buy into the vision and goals of your company with their mind and soul. Or would you prefer that your employees be half committed to their jobs and not be willing to do their best, and that they're just there for the benefits and paycheck.

Microsoft has a culture, Google has a culture and Disney has a culture, to those who like it those corporations are brilliant and to those who disagree it's cult-like. I say to each his own, Epic employees I'm sure are smart and bright (esp if they all graduated from college), they can make their own decisions on whether they like Epic or not and obviously move on if they don't ... no different from any other job out there.